For all of you who have been concerned about the diagnosis of "Baker's Cyst" and wondered what it causes, here are the answers I got from my orthpaedic surgeon today. When I said I had been diagnosed with one three weeks ago my doctor said, "That's NOTHING. A Baker's Cyst is only the result of something else going on in the knee. You have to treat the cause of what is making the extra fluid in the joint that is filling up the cyst. A Baker's Cyst doesn't hurt. It does not cause pain. We don't even operate on them anymore. It is INSIGNIFICANT."
So, I FINALLY got the answer to my questions. The cyst was not what was causing the pain in my case. I have another condition which creates bone rubbing on bone. Muscle strenghtening in the thigh and a shot ofcortisone was the prescribed treatment.
I just wanted to share what I found out.
Follow Ups:
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash
Posted by Leslie on February 16, 1999 at 22:38:16:
In Reply to: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by susan on February 16, 1999 at 13:06:20:
So the pain I am having in my calf, upper asnd lower and around the knee and upper leg (inner) and the upper calf swelling, may not be cyst related?
Follow Ups:
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash
Posted by susan on February 16, 1999 at 23:17:48:
In Reply to: Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by Leslie on February 16, 1999 at 22:38:16:
The way it was explained to me today by the surgeon was the Baker's Cyst is the result of something else that is going on. There is an irritation that is producing extra fluid in the knee joint which is going into the sac. You must diagnose and treat the condition that is causing this excess fluid. In the last three weeks, I have been trying to find out what this cyst DOES to a person to make him experience pain. I was suspecting a tear somewhere and not just a cyst that was causing my pain. HE said the Baker's Cyst doesn't hurt and just pooh-poohed it as nothing to be concerned about. He is treating my underlying condition, not the Baker's Cyst. Whether or not you can buy into that, I guess, is up to you. That's just what he told me and it seems to make sense to me. It is hard to know who to believe these days, though, isn't it?
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Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash (LIMITED VALIDITY)
Posted by Walt Stoll on February 17, 1999 at 11:18:39:
In Reply to: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by susan on February 16, 1999 at 13:06:20:
Dear Susan.
It continues to amaze me how much more credence is lent to advice you pay for than that that is offered free.
This advice is only partially accurate at best. Baker's Cysts CAN hurt a lot & the symptoms are relieved by their removal. See the link below.
However, at least he is correct in saying that the cyst is but an indication of what is going wrong in the joint----
exactly what I have been trtying to tell everyone on this BB for years.
Did this doc tell you anything about what YOU could do to change those causes? Likely not. You are not at the mercy of these processes OR of the doc unless you still think you can pay someone else to do your thinking for you.
Walt
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash (LIMITED VALIDITY)
Posted by susan on February 17, 1999 at 12:35:45:
In Reply to: Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash (LIMITED VALIDITY) posted by Walt Stoll on February 17, 1999 at 11:18:39:
Dear Dr. Stoll,
It is not that I am putting more credence in advice that I paid for, it is that that was the only way a got an answer to my question. As you know, I tried many times, unsucessfully, to get specific answers from you. I did learn from you about how the cyst can be caused from arthritis. I did all the possible research I could do on the web to find out about surgery, draining it, etc. I found some conflicting reports. So then I was back to square 1 with "who do you believe?". You know what I needed to know from you, but you did not provide me with the specific answers to my questions. Do I think orthopaedic surgeons are "gods"? Absolutely not! Some of them barely touch you or merely take an x-ray to make a diagnosis. I had a reocurrent back/knee problem several years ago and went to doctors and through physical therapy and they only thing that cured me was to have theraputic massages (which, by the way, no one recommended). It really was a muscular thing--something orthopaedic guys don't often buy into. So I really believe in your message about total relaxation therapy. The reason I am believing my doctor (for now) is that he does surgery a lot every week and I would expect him to be right up to date on this cyst thing. I have to give you credit for one thing--when he tried to give me the cortisone shot he had to tell me three times to relax my leg. He kept saying that it would hurt a lot less if I just relaxed it! Well, I couldn't do it consciously. There's a point for your muscle theory. Thanks for all the time you give to this board. You are helping alot of people.
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash
Posted by Mary Ann on February 17, 1999 at 18:09:30:
In Reply to: Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by susan on February 16, 1999 at 23:17:48:
I am told that my Baker's cyst is caused by lack of cartilage on one side of the knee. Bone on bone.I was told to have a total knee replacement. At age 53 I am not ready to have this procedure done. I am taking Osteo-Bi-flex and doing leg lifts to stregthen the muscle. Also going to a chiropractor. I really would like to put off total knee replacement for as long as I can. I was also told that the replacement lasts for a good 20 years????
Follow Ups:
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash
Posted by susan on February 17, 1999 at 20:05:10:
In Reply to: Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by Mary Ann on February 17, 1999 at 18:09:30:
That's what I've got--the bone rubbing on bone. I am 55 and my doctor said IF I were older, they'd just do a knee replacement, but I am much too young for that. He said it wouldn't do any good to do an operation because it wouldn't cure the problem, it would just keep coming back. He said that doing leg lifts three times a day would strengthen the muscle which will keep the kneecap from rubbing on the bone, then lots of walking and/or water exercises in which you keep your knee straight. The cortisone shot helps a lot of people, but he will give it only twice a year. He mentioned in his dictation that arthoscopic laser surgery may be indicatated at a later date. I'm not sure what that was all about. I'm just going to see how the shot and exercise affects me over the next few weeks. He said it would take about three weeks for the muscle to noticibly strengthen. I guess it all depends on how bad the deterioration of your bone is as to when you need a joint replacement. He did say I was having a lot of grinding--lots more than people older than I. So maybe I'm 55, but my knee is more like 72! What did your doctor say about your cyst? Was he on the same wavelength as my doctor? Is that a medication that you mentioned you are on? Is it helping?
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash
Posted by Walt Stoll on February 18, 1999 at 11:14:44:
In Reply to: Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by Mary Ann on February 17, 1999 at 18:09:30:
Dear Mary Ann,
Your Baker's Cyst is NOT caused by the loss of the cartilege but both are caused by the same susceptibility factors. Your doc is guilty of the old logic trap that all MDs are warned about in medical school. "Post hoc ergo propter hoc" means "after this, therefore because of this".
Aparently he never learned that one.
Just because docs have noticed that many people who have lost the cartilege in their knees also have Baker's........
(sigh)!
Anyhow, if you take the time to read all the stuff (on this BB & archives) about Baker's you will know more about it than your doc does.
Next, by far the most effective thing you could do to delay knee replacement (although you still may have to eventually have the surgery) would be glucosamine sulfate (750 milligrams twice a day) and the essential oils described on the homepage of this site AND the underwater exercises every community with an indoor pool has now. The less you use the knee for weight bearing the longer it will last and the less you weigh the longer it will last.
You might even consider a cane since you can put some of the weight on the opposite arm & shoulder to take some of it off that knee.
Let us know how you do.
Walt
Re: Baker's Cyst Newsflash(article on knee & joint health)
Posted by Denise Wyrick on February 20, 1999 at 22:59:41:
In Reply to: Baker's Cyst Newsflash posted by susan on February 16, 1999 at 13:06:20:
Hi all, I don't know whether anyone is still reading this thread... but I just found an article in the Townsend Newsletters that would be very helpful to folks that suffer from Baker's cysts and arthritic conditions. It makes me very angry to think that docs told me to take medications that were destined to create a deterioration of the joints. Sadly, this is the norm. IMHO telling someone to take anti-inflammatories on a long term basis is grounds to sue for malpractice. Why is this so difficult for traditional doctors to understand? OK I'm off my soapbox now :-)
http://tldp.com/issue/177/joints.html
All the best
Denise Wyrick
PS: That was a rhetorical question....I know why docs don't recommend the alternatives, there isn't any $$ in it.